scams are a dime a dozen.
You already know to keep your guard up when
you check your email or when you swipe right.
But did you know how hard it can be to avoid getting tricked when you're buying a dog?
What do you think of the companies that do this honestly scumbags?
I usually report on politics and crime,
but I turned my attention to puppies because well there's something going on
in our pet industry that not enough of us are talking about.
Yeah.
Animal lovers definitely listen to this
season for the investigative podcast series,
smokescreen puppy Kingpin is officially out and
like you just heard the season takes
listeners on an investigation on a multimillion
dollar scheme to illegally sell puppy mill dogs
and the woman behind the con host of the podcast series
smokescreen puppy Kingpin Alex schuman actually joined us here to scott.
So interesting check it out.
You did mention in a recent instagram post,
this is one of the weirdest stories that you've covered.
So how did you even discover this problem?
I initially found out about it because the Iowa
attorney General had released a statement that they had,
it started investigating this case and this idea of puppy laundering?
Um it was the first case of its kind and I just thought,
well that sounds weird why what exactly is puppy laundering?
Why would you need to launder a puppy in the first place?
So I just started digging and I'm originally
from Iowa which is where this is mostly centered
and it just slowly but surely like you
started to realize how complicated this scheme was,
How much there was to talk about and how
little I think the regular consumer and pet owner
realizes and knows about the pet industry
and the podcast follows you as you expose this scheme.
What challenges did you face during the investigation?
I think the toughest thing is the secrecy in which the pet industry operates.
There's certain parts of it, not the entire industry,
but I think I was really taken aback by
how little they want you to know when it comes
to figuring out where a puppy originally came from.
I mean we, and, and the layers of excuse me, the layers of secrecy involved,
there were very challenging to figure out.
So you had to turn to a lot of legal documents, read a lot of paperwork,
look at like microchip numbers and try and really literally follow
the puppies and the way that people talk about following the money
you to follow the puppies to figure out where everything started.
What did you learn in this process?
I learned a lot of things.
I think one of the core things that I walked
away with is that a puppy mill is not illegal.
Um, I think a lot of us think that the term puppy mill, I think you think that, oh,
that somehow a lawbreaker,
but there's no actual definition like legally of a puppy mill
and then also that they can exist at USDA licensed facilities like
and our second episode really exposes how a usd
license doesn't necessarily mean there's not cruelty happening.
What were you surprised with when you were doing this investigation?
Besides what you just mentioned,
I think
the secrecy,
the lack of legal definitions and then just the
amount of deception and misdirection a consumer can face
when they just want to get a healthy puppy.
I mean in the case of puppy kingpin,
we're talking about fake rescues and people that are
accused of creating dog shelters and in theory,
if you're a dog consumer,
I mean you don't have days and months like I did to figure
this out and make foia requests and do all these different things.
And so I think just how aware you have to be as a
potential pet owner was one of the biggest surprises because it's puppies right?
You wouldn't expect, yeah, you don't expect it when you're wanting to get a dog,
someone tells me that's a rescue puppy,
I'm going to believe that it's a rescue puppy.
That's so surprising.
So when it comes to podcasts and other true crime podcast,
why do you think people are so obsessed with these stories Alex?
I think that it's because you know the line between a
very good business bottle and a scam is pretty thin.
Like I think I think that it's something about
it is that these people are a little relatable.
We've all had that moment where you have to decide are you
going to make the right decision or you or you know,
are you going to do something else?
Maybe?
And so I think that there's something about these
people making that choice and then seeing what happens,
that there's like a dark interest in it.
Um and then I think that just that we like the escapism of true crime,
we are getting tired of politics, we are just tired of these other types of topics.
And true crime is still this
totally separate world where it's a simple story for you to follow.
What are you hoping this season of smokescreen puppy Kingpin has on people?
What's the impact you're hoping for?
I think people will walk away.
I hope that people walk away with a better understanding of the pet industry
actually knowing how difficult it is to figure out where your puppy came from,
and then also exposing this fraud.
I mean, I think that now the biggest thing, you know, as you know, is a journalist,
like one of the biggest things you can do with a scam is simply make people aware of it?
And there's not always necessarily a lot more you can do.
So I think getting the awareness out there.
So what happens to the people behind these schemes?
Do we get justice or closure for these puppies?
Well, we definitely there, that's there's still a process happening at this point,
Like there's still legal proceedings, there still
there are conclusions to certain aspects of it. Yes,
and thanks to the host of the podcast series, Smokescreen puppy Kingpin,
Alex Shuman.