President Joe biden spoke with Ukrainian
President Volodymyr Zelensky over the weekend just
days after he had a phone call with Russian President Vladimir Putin.
The calls come as us is preparing to meet with Russia next week
to discuss concern about Russia's military build up near the Ukrainian border.
Russia now has
an estimated 100,000 troops deployed there raising
fears is preparing for an invasion.
Joining me now to discuss is Mustafa Tammy's former consultant,
the Department of Homeland Security under the George W Bush administration
and a Democratic strategist.
So Mustafa,
why was it important for President Zelensky to
speak with President Biden ahead of the talks?
And can you recap for us? What was discussed?
Look,
it's very important for the United States to show its commitment uh to its NATO ally,
Ukraine.
And this conversation with President Zelensky does
that it sends a clear message that
the United States stands with Ukraine and
that as it negotiates with Vladimir Putin,
that he knows that our commitment to this ally is not going to change,
not just by the United States, but all of NATO
now from Ukraine's perspective,
how important are the upcoming talks between Western powers and
Russia and what do they hope will come out of?
It
looks critical that they're looking for some
buffer against Vladimir Putin's incursions into Ukraine.
Um You know,
we saw that he annexed Crimea in the past uh that this troop
build up could be another way of them taking additional territories in Ukraine.
Uh And Vladimir Putin has also launched an all out campaign for separatists
within Ukraine, he's got operatives, got Russian operatives inside the country,
he has attacked them in the cyberspace,
and through social media has been very
aggressive and and Vladimir Putin is trying to
do everything he can uh to to disturb the membership of Ukraine into NATO,
Which was promised to Ukraine in 2008.
And so he's testing, you know,
where NATO is with Ukraine and trying to push back
against any movement and further support of of Ukraine.
And without that buffer, all of Eastern europe is potentially blackmail.
So is Putin's troop build up a serious sign of threat?
Or is it a show of pressure to get the west to get to get what he wants.
Well look, I mean,
NATO was created to push back against the former soviet
union and as the as the soviet union fell apart.
Uh the the offer was extended to other countries to join Ukraine was one of them.
But Vladimir Putin is trying to do, he's trying to reclaim that
that Russian empire. He's trying to reassert Russia's role
uh and globally as well as in Eastern europe, and he sees uh Ukraine's uh you know,
membership into NATO, he wants to make sure that that doesn't happen.
And again,
he he is uh he's a dictator and he's a thug and he
is a bully and that's exactly what he's doing in in this,
in this latest troop build up on Ukraine's board.
Now it sounds like there's a deadlock between Western countries saying that they
will not reject Ukraine's membership to NATO
and Russia saying it will not deescalate
if demands are not met. So what can come out of the upcoming talks?
You know, we have to uh, it's like when you have a child that, that,
you know, screaming, yelling, throwing a temper tantrum,
you have to figure out how to contain that.
And that's exactly what what has President biden has to
do here is a difficult task in front of him.
The tools he has, his disposal are continuing to increase those sanctions.
We hope that it doesn't get up to some kind of a troop build up by NATO.
Although there are there's a letter that was signed by
20 former military and regional experts encouraging NATO to build a
troop presence and a permanent presence
uh, in the near Ukraine, in in in in in the gulf there. So,
you know, you don't want it to escalate their nuclear powers that are involved.
We have to find a diplomatic path.
But in order to do that, we need a diplomatic partner.
Now,
both President biden and NATO countries have said Russia will face
some tough economic sanctions if it invades Ukraine and in today's interconnected
interconnected world.
What means do we have to punish Russia without facing consequences ourselves?
Well, you know, the Russian economy
When oil was $20 a barrel was suffering. You know.
Now the oil is back to $80 a barrel,
the Russian economy is starting to come back and doing better?
Uh, further sanctions put back Russian economy to what it used to be.
So, uh, the United States can sanction uh, some key oligarchs that are around
Vladimir Putin,
uh,
we can sanction some additional sanctions on various things
that Russia sells to to hurt its economy.
But at the end of the day, Vladimir Putin has to change his way.
And I'm just not sure if any of this will be effective.
Now, is the US ready to fight for Ukraine? If it were to be attacked by Russia or or not?
Well, that's the thing. Uh, Ukraine is not a member of NATO.
So there is not a treaty, uh,
that's in place that says that all of the NATO
countries will fight on behalf of Ukraine should Ukraine was attacked
at the same time? Ukraine is an ally of NATO and therefore the United States.
And so Vladimir Putin is testing that, how far can he take this?
Because he knows there's not a treaty, so we're not obligated by treaty,
but he knows that if he is able to push us, how far can you push the envelope?
And that's exactly what he's doing right now.
Now, my last question for you,
do you think there's a diplomatic solution to this situation, and what might it be?
Well, look at the end of the day, we have to find,
what is the leverage against Vladimir Putin
uh if there are sanctions, what kind of sanctions,
how do we how do we put them in position?
I I for one think that
he is testing how far he can push uh not just the biden administration,
but all of europe.
He's trying to find out what are the limits to which he can
take this and I think he's going to continue to do so.
I don't I think that he's he understands what american politics are.
He's looking at the next election cycle,
He's looking at President biden's numbers and he wants to, you know,
he wants to push the United States.
So this is going to be a dance that's going to go back and forth.
At the end of the day,
no one wants to get too close to a armed conflict
with countries that are have nuclear weapons on all sides.
Alright,
Mustafa Tammy's former consultant of the Department of Homeland Security
under the George W Bush administration and a Democratic strategist.
Thank you so much sir for your time and expertise